This just makes me so fucking angry it is unbelievable! It is the rank hypocrisy of the whole situation; on the one hand we have the Americans paying lip service to a whole bundle of lies “we need a sustainable ceasefire”, whilst on the other hand they are sending the Israelis the bombs to drop on innocent people in places like Beirut! I notice that Margaret Beckett made no other comment than to say that the only concern of our government was that the paperwork was not right; well what should we expect from a government whose leader spends the majority of his time licking the ass of a complete moron (yes I mean old George W himself). As far as I am concerned the person who provides the gun which kills someone is equally as guilty as the person who pulls the trigger; and it would be good to see both Blair and Bush in the dock for supplying Israel with the means to murder innocent people in the name of “self defence”.
I also notice that Blair is going to be pushing Bush to insist on an immediate ceasefire; fat chance give the record of the US vetoing anything concerning Israel in the UN. maybe if he licks a little harder GW might just notice that he is there…
The only way to stop this is for the US to get its collective head out of its collective arse and to a) support sanctions, preferrably economic sanctions, against Israel, and b) stop supplying the arms necessary for Israel to continue its disproportionate punishment of innocent people. That also applies to our own government; the sooner that Blair wakes up and realises that for a number of years now the moron has been making him look a complete and utter twat (although I don’t think that much help was needed there) the better.
July 31, 2006 at 7:32 pm
The US admin have been trying to find an excuse to go to war with Syria nad Iran but cannot garner support at home or abroad for a preemptive strike. I suspect the US is pandering to Israel’s natural aggressive tendancies in the hope that given enough attrocities committed against arabs Syria and Iran will become involved and thus give Bush the excuse to join in on behalf of the US’s ally Israel.
July 31, 2006 at 9:31 pm
Welcome to the madhouse Art; an interesting comment and one with which I think I agree…
Bush, Blair and co. have the knack of talking the talk, but when it comes to walking the walk they fall flat on their faces!
August 1, 2006 at 7:49 pm
Fewer innocent people being murdered for a start David!
August 1, 2006 at 11:03 pm
I wasn’t suggesting disaming Israel David (Though removing their nukes would probably help substantially in easing tensions in the ME)My suggestion is merely to stop rushing new supplies to them. They have more than enough inventory of weapons to defend themselves against any attack but without resupply they would not have enough to continue to wage their current murderous onslaughts against innocent palestinian and lebanese civilians.
Just to recap the current score is Palestine 140 civilians killed vs 1 Israeli soldier and in Lebanon 750 innocent civilians killed vs 18 Israeli civilians. So remind me again who are the terrorists in the ME?
August 2, 2006 at 7:58 am
So David yopu advocate allowing the expansionist Israeli’s a free hand to do just what they like in the ME and run around murdering innocent people as a “punishment” and in the interests of “self protection”; actually lets not forget who set this whole train of events in motion in the first place; and I am not talking recent history here. The Israeli’s originally set the whole thing off with their expansionist policies, taking land from the Arabs who they see as not much above savages. So don’t give all this guff about “self protection” etc. this is nothing more nor less than state sponsored terrorism; and some good old economic sanctions against Israel might force them to sit at a table and talk rather than run riot murdering innocent people!
August 2, 2006 at 8:16 pm
No David! If you read all three posts I have made on this topic you will see that NOWHERE have I called for Israel to be disarmed, the point I constantly make and will continue to make is that if the US stopped being so bloody pro-Israeli we would not have the siuation that we now have; so please DO NOT put words in my mouth, because the first use of the word disarmed was by you in your first comment. I have been down this road many times with the English Nationalists who have a habit of doing exactly what you have just done.
The only way to get the Israeli’s to sit up and take notice is for the US to stop tacitly supporting them and for the US to support economic sanctions against Israel. Also, nowehere have I mentioned that Israel does not haver the right to protect itself, and neither would I; however, when “protecting yourself” amounts to using disproportionate force against innocent people then I think that it has gone beyond protection and spilled over into something quite different…
August 3, 2006 at 4:24 pm
Here is an extract from the summary of the US based Human Rights Group’s report into Israel’s attacks on Lebanon.
[Quote]Summary
This report documents serious violations of international humanitarian law (the laws of war) by Israel Defense Forces (IDF) in Lebanon between July 12 and July 27, 2006, as well as the July 30 attack in Qana. During this period, the IDF killed an estimated 400 people, the vast majority of them civilians, and that number climbed to over 500 by the time this report went to print. The Israeli government claims it is taking all possible measures to minimize civilian harm, but the cases documented here reveal a systematic failure by the IDF to distinguish between combatants and civilians.
Since the start of the conflict, Israeli forces have consistently launched artillery and air attacks with limited or dubious military gain but excessive civilian cost. In dozens of attacks, Israeli forces struck an area with no apparent military target. In some cases, the timing and intensity of the attack, the absence of a military target, as well as return strikes on rescuers, suggest that Israeli forces deliberately targeted civilians.
The Israeli government claims that it targets only Hezbollah, and that fighters from the group are using civilians as human shields, thereby placing them at risk. Human Rights Watch found no cases in which Hezbollah deliberately used civilians as shields to protect them from retaliatory IDF attack. Hezbollah occasionally did store weapons in or near civilian homes and fighters placed rocket launchers within populated areas or near U.N. observers, which are serious violations of the laws of war because they violate the duty to take all feasible precautions to avoid civilian casualties. However, those cases do not justify the IDF’s extensive use of indiscriminate force which has cost so many civilian lives. In none of the cases of civilian deaths documented in this report is there evidence to suggest that Hezbollah forces or weapons were in or near the area that the IDF targeted during or just prior to the attack.
By consistently failing to distinguish between combatants and civilians, Israel has violated one of the most fundamental tenets of the laws of war: the duty to carry out attacks on only military targets. The pattern of attacks during the Israeli offensive in Lebanon suggests that the failures cannot be explained or dismissed as mere accidents; the extent of the pattern and the seriousness of the consequences indicate the commission of war crimes. [/quote]
The full text xan be read here http://hrw.org/reports/2006/lebanon0806/2.htm#_Toc142299220
David if there is some part of this you cannot understand then please feel free to ask.
August 3, 2006 at 4:54 pm
Well pointed out Art!
David, I can see how you are twisting what I have said, but those quotes are far from asking that the Israeli’s be disarmed; what I am getting at there is that I think that Bush and Blair are equally as guilty as the Israeli’s for supplying the arms that Israel are using it murder innocent people, and you know that perfectly well…
What I am acutally saying is that by tacitly, or otherwise, supporting Israel the US, and Britain, are equally guilty for the murder of innocent people; also that if the US, and Britain, removed that tacit, opr otherwise, support then Israel would be forced to sit at the table and talk rather that throwing bombs all over the place… It is pretty simple really…
August 4, 2006 at 10:33 am
I suspect Israel is beginning to regret ever embarking on this military misadventure. This is becoming severely embarrassing for them and is seriously undermining their image of invulnerability in the ME. They are fighting 2000 lightly armed militants who despite Israel’s ENORMOUS advantage in men and military hardware are inflicting proportionately huge damage on Israel’s military with a further 5 IDF members killed today on top of the 4 killed yesterday. To-date Israel has lost at least 45 soldiers whilst Hizbollah have lost 46 fighters and Israel have managed to advance only a few kilometres into Lebanon.
This is now the longest war Israel has ever been involved in with no hint of them achieving even a scintilla of their stated goals. Israel are desperately trying to claim victory so they can withdraw but Ehud Olmerts declaration a couple of days ago that they had virtually destroyed Hezbollah’s infrastructure resulted in 230 rockets being fired at Israel within hours. Hezbollah’s offer to stop firing rockets at Israel if Israel stopped bombing civilians was dismissed by Israel as a sign of weakness ??? Israel’s response was the heaviest air attacks on Beirut civilians to-date. Olmert seems to have totally lost the plot!!
All Israel have succeeded in doing is disgusting world opinion with their indiscriminate, cowardly, spiteful attacks on lebanese infrastructure, civilians and international aid workers and elevating a hitherto small and generally unpopular militia to the status of heros in the arab world.
I suspect Israel is now hoping the UN pass a resolution calling for a ceasefire as a face saving means of disengaging. Failing that the Israelis will probably end up nuking southern lebanon in a fit of pique
August 4, 2006 at 11:21 am
Impressive piece of analysis Art, although I think I would disagree with you on one small point “Olmert seems to have totally lost the plot!!” I seriously question if he ever had the plot to lose in the first place. I sincerely hope that there is a UN resolution calling for a ceasefire, and that the US does not follow past form and veto it; although if that were to happen it would make the US look even worse than Israel does at present.
August 7, 2006 at 1:18 pm
I am drawing a line under this post and will make no more comments because I refuse to enter into a debate with someone who is being deliberately provocative simply for the sake of it. I have better things to do with my very valuable time! Therefore, I think that we simply have to agree to disagree…